EBB 177 – Pregnancy After 35 and the Experience of an Unplanned Homebirth with Mera and Dimitri

Learn more about Juliann Lee here (https://www.littleorchidsbirth.com/meet-juliann).

Rebecca Dekker:

Hi, everyone. On today’s podcast we’re going to talk with Mera and Dimitri about having their fourth baby after the age of 35 and giving birth before they could make it to the hospital. Welcome to the Evidence Based Birth® Podcast. My name is Rebecca Dekker and I’m a nurse with my PhD and the founder of Evidence Based Birth®. Join me each week as we work together to get evidence-based information into the hands of families and professionals around the world. As a reminder, this information is not medical advice. See evbirth.com/disclaimer, for more details. Hi, everyone. Today I’m so excited to welcome Mera and Dimitri to the Evidence Based Birth® Podcast. Mera is a freelance writer, enrichment educator, and mom of four living in South Carolina. In her spare time, Mera loves writing, listening to music, reading, dancing, and cooking. Dimitri is an army veteran studying computer science and a father of four in South Carolina. When he does get spare time, he enjoys playing video games and doing yard work, which he says is fun and a way to get some quiet and relaxation.

Mera and Dimitri recently gave birth to their baby in October of 2020. And they took the Evidence Based Birth® Childbirth class with EBB instructor, Juliann Lee, who is also based in South Carolina. They’re here today to share their very exciting birth story in which they gave birth in their living room before they could make it to the hospital. So welcome Mera and Dimitri to the Evidence Based Birth® Podcast.

Mera:

Thank you.

Dimitri:

Thank you.

Rebecca Dekker:

So we’re so excited to have you here to share your exciting birth story. I was wondering if you could start off by telling us where you found yourself in this pregnancy and how you found out about the Evidence Based Birth® Childbirth class, why you decided to take it when you’ve had children before.

Mera:

With the COVID thing I think I just… For one thing that I was 36, but also I just felt it was a little bit of a difficult pregnancy and I wanted to… I guess we decided to have a hospital birth, right?

Dimitri:

Yeah.

Mera:

And I have had a couple, all of my births prior were planned home births, although they didn’t always all end up at home, but because of that, I wanted to get more education about how to have a birth in the hospital. So I think that’s how we… And I think I read articles about, on your website several times before, but I didn’t know that there was an actual childbirth education program, but once I found that, actually I was looking for midwives and post partum doulas and everything. And that’s when I found the childbirth education educator that we went with.

Rebecca Dekker:

So tell us a little bit about the fact that you’d had three home births before. How did those experiences go and what led you to choose a hospital birth this time?

Mera:

So I had two home births and one was planned home birth, but I went to the hospital. So I was younger, my first was 23 and I had just had a really amazing team, a lot of support. And I think I was in much better shape just my health and all. Also, I lived in an area that there was a lot more going on. We live in a pretty small town now. And the one that I did have that ended up in the hospital was really traumatic so I wanted to educate myself on how to make it not traumatic. So that was my viewpoint. And I’ve always been really into birth work, since before my first daughter was born. So I love evidence. I love to go with an evidence-based plan, I guess you could say. So, yeah, there wasn’t a lot of options for midwives here that I trusted and that we could also afford. And I don’t remember if we found the midwife before we took the childbirth classes?

Dimitri:

I think we did. I know the last birth was an unplanned home birth, she wanted to do a home birth and we had a midwife lined up. It’s just, he came out so quick that I was at work and by the time I got home within 15 minutes, he was out and I worked four minutes away. I think that she wanted to do the hospital birth just because the fact that she was a little bit older and wanting to make sure that if anything was going to go wrong, there was a place that could take care of her quickly and that everything was going to be okay, as far as that.

Rebecca Dekker:

For a variety of reasons you switched to, or you decided a hospital birth, and this was your fourth time giving birth?

Mera:

Yes.

Rebecca Dekker:

And just briefly, could you tell us how the first three births went? You said the third one was really fast. How were the first and second ones?

Mera:

My first birth was eight hours and it was really, I had a waterbirth and I got in the water pretty early after I went into labor and I had a midwife and two doulas, and it was just really calm. I was relaxed the whole time. And just during that pregnancy, I’d been doing yoga and meditation classes all day, every day. I had been recently finished a yoga teacher training and I was working with the owner of the yoga studio. And she had me in all her classes all the time. So the birth was like a yoga class for me. So it was really relaxing and easy. And my second birth, I guess I thought it was going to be at the same way, but I had moved to California and moved in with a family member who had a lot of people in her house.

We moved there specifically just to give birth because we live so far away in the desert at that time, from anything. So we moved to a city and she had a lot of people in and out of her house. So it was just really stressful. And labor was really prodromal. It was just taking a super long time and I had gotten exhausted so I ended up going into the hospital after almost 48 hours or something like that. It was a shock to me that I wasn’t allowed to move around and they were not very nice to me. And then after my baby was born, they took her away from me for five hours, even though they said they were going to bring her right to me after they switched rooms. So it was just, it was bad in a lot of ways, but it was a natural vaginal birth. All of mine have been luckily and I was fine and she was fine. It was traumatic just the way that I was treated basically.

Rebecca Dekker:

And then your third one was the one where the baby came too quickly Dimitri just barely got home in time?

Mera:

Yeah.

Rebecca Dekker:

So that sets us up to this fourth birthday you were planning at a hospital with a hospital-based midwife and you started taking the Evidence Based Birth® Childbirth class. What was your experience like taking the class?

Mera:

We started late just because we had gone through a different doctor before that, that ended up really badly. So we started late and it was a lot, it was a lot of information. A lot of it, I think I already knew, I think he already knew, but it was also very, for me, it felt it was very empowering. It was very thorough.

Dimitri:

But with the evidence based class, it really gave her the confidence, especially after her previous experience in the hospital, to have the confidence to go into the hospital and advocate for her rights and gave me an idea of what I should be looking for in order to advocate for her while she’s going into labor. Had it been that situation. But as far as for me, a lot of stuff, it really helped me. When, next thing I know I’m delivering a baby in my living room to understand what was happening. If we do this may happen, if we do that may happen. So it was a little bit eyeopening, but overall for me, anyway, it helped out, made things a lot less stressful as far as the birth and her going to the hospital. She was more open to the idea of it at that point.

Rebecca Dekker:

Yeah. So it sounds like a lot of it was in some cases, a review, but maybe it felt empowering to know that the evidence backed up some of the things that you wanted. And then also, just talking about advocacy skills, and how to use your voice. And then Dimitri, you felt more confident in the stages of labor and what was actually happening when you had to help with the birth of this baby in your living room. So before that exciting birth, take us to the end of your pregnancy, what kind of birth were you hoping for and what was your mindset like? It sounds like you were hoping to go to the hospital and be there with your midwife.

Mera:

Yes. I really got lucky to find our midwife at the end, I think I was 32 weeks.

Rebecca Dekker:

Oh, wow.

Mera:

Then I found her because of the doctor we had before that dumped me, because I think we had started the training before that, or I hadn’t been reading articles or something, and she wanted to give me a vaginal exam and some kind of STD tests at 32 weeks or something like that, really late. And I didn’t feel like that was necessary and I declined and she really put on a lot of intimidation and shame and guilt. And so I was really worried for a little while and went and talked to people in the birth community and found the midwife that we had. And I really had a really good bond with her. And based on the information you guys gave on how to choose a provider, I was able to talk with her about the right things to help me really quickly know that she was what we were looking for. So I did want to go in there and experience that, but we didn’t get that.

Dimitri:

We didn’t get that.

Rebecca Dekker:

And were you planning to be un-medicated birth then? Would have been un-medicated.

Mera:

Yes. She was 100% supportive of everything that I wanted, which was just as natural as possible, as hands-off as possible.

Dimitri:

And the way they have the hospital room set up at that particular hospital, in a sense in having that natural birth, the uninterrupted that you wanted had we gotten there.

Rebecca Dekker:

So the hospital itself was supportive of un-medicated birth?

Mera:

Yes.

Dimitri:

Yes.

Rebecca Dekker:

And it sounds like you saw, there was basically a giant red flag at your OB appointment. And was that hard to switch providers or did it feel fairly easy to just find someone new? Because a lot of people face red flags during pregnancy with their providers, but they are afraid to switch. So I don’t know if you could talk a little bit more about that.

Mera:

Yeah. It was really overwhelming for me because it was pretty late in the game. And I, previous to that, did just didn’t have a good outlook on having a hospital birth anyway. So I didn’t think I was going to find anybody good. But we live in the middle of two cities-

Dimitri:

Two distance size cities.

Mera:

So I was able to talk to an old nurse-midwife who had worked with my first midwife that I had with my first baby. And she told me about the midwives at this hospital specifically, the one that I ended up with. No, but it was really stressful. I didn’t think I was going to find anyone. And I just told everybody that I knew for like a week or so that I needed help basically, because I was really stressed about it. And I knew I couldn’t go with that lady because she also was trying to tell me way ahead of time that I was going to have to be induced. And I didn’t, I was just not going to let that happen. But the point where I got dumped, I was like, okay, I didn’t really need to go with her anyway, because she wasn’t really supporting me.

Rebecca Dekker:

And I guess not that you said I’m firing you, they literally fired you as a patient?

Mera:

Yeah. It’s like, if you don’t do this right now, then we’re not going to hear from you anymore. So leave. And I’m like, okay.

Rebecca Dekker:

Wow. But then thankfully you found the right person to support you for the rest of your pregnancy. So that happened in your third trimester and then you get to the end of your pregnancy. What was your mindset like at the end? Did you feel at peace about everything? Were you excited or were you nervous?

Mera:

I was nervous. I guess I oscillated between a kind of excited, calm, and nervousness because there’s just a lot of unknown. I had never had a planned hospital birth. And even though I felt prepared and I loved my midwife, there was a possibility that even if we did end up there, she might not have been there. And she told me, “Trust, everybody will be supportive because we have taken care of you and everything’s been recorded,” but I didn’t trust those other people because I didn’t know them.

Dimitri:

I think with the appointments that we did and just talking to the midwives and going through appointments and finding out how the birth was supposed to be set up, it calmed you to the point where you were open and you… She was a little, she was excited about it. She was looking forward to it, but she was hesitant just because of her previous experiences at the hospital and not knowing.

Rebecca Dekker:

Yeah. That’s totally understandable. And Dimitri, how about you? Were you feeling pretty confident towards the end?

Dimitri:

Yeah. I’m a go with the flow kind of guy. We had it set up, we had the midwife, we had a plan. So all we had to do is execute the plan and I work perfectly that way. So I had no worries at all.

Rebecca Dekker:

That’s awesome. So share your birth story with us. How did it begin?

Mera:

Okay. So I would say it began on September 29th, Oh, 30, yeah.

Dimitri:

It was September 30th because I was in class taking a test and she was telling me that she’s having contractions. She thinks the baby’s coming either today or tomorrow. So I was like, okay, cool. I called into to work. I said, “Hey, probably going to have a baby either today or tomorrow. So won’t be at work.” I get home and the contractions are really spaced apart. So she’s fine. She’s walking around. The rest of the day goes by nothing happened. So I’m like, okay, no, baby, we go to bed. About 4:00 AM, the contractions really start. So she’s literally going into active labor at this point. And our plan was to not try to rush to the hospital because we wanted to make sure we could get there in the timeframe where the baby’s going to come soon, but we’d have enough time.

So about 4:00, 4:30 in the morning, active labor started happening. So she was really going into it. So we got up and I started doing some of the things, the massages and stuff that we learned about through the program, counter pressure that we learned through the program and I think about, I don’t know, 30 minutes into that, it was really getting intense so she wanted to go into the bath, into the birth pool, but from my understanding, from the course, that sometimes pool accelerates birth. So I was trying to talk her out of it just because I’m like, I don’t really want to have this baby here at the house if you get in the pool. I don’t want the baby to come as soon as you get in the pool because the last one just showed up. So I finally just set up the pool with her, because I’m not going to argue with a woman in labor. So I set up the pool, she got into the pool, she was in the pool for probably 10 minutes and it was happening.

I thought we could still make it to the hospital, but at that point in time looking back on it, no, it was happening, once we got in the pool, that was that, it was done. So I finally convinced her, okay, we need to go to the hospital. I helped her out of the pool. We put on a robe for her. And we started walking to the front door to get ready to go. Mind you, all three other kids are right here. Just awake-

Mera:

I was going on with the other kids.

Dimitri:

Yeah. They’re all here, awake, alert. They see everything that’s going on. So we’re walking to the front door, this is like 6:30. We get to the living room, she falls down on all fours and she goes, baby’s coming. I go to look and then I’m just soaked in embryonic fluid. And then baby come and the baby just comes right out. And there it is, in what? Two hours. And it was done.

Rebecca Dekker:

Wow. That sounds like a very thrilling moment for both of you. Mera what was your experience like going through that process? Did you realize that you weren’t going to make it time?

Mera:

No, I really didn’t. I don’t remember it the way he remembers it. Yeah. So in my mind, I was just somewhere else. Let’s just, honestly, I was just somewhere else. I was in some other world. I don’t remember the children being there until the very end and they were somewhere off. I heard them, but I couldn’t see them, even though they were apparently just staring right at me, but I was just going through all of the feelings. My whole body just felt, I just felt this really intense pressure. And I just, maybe it was what I wanted, I wanted it to be calm and slow and it wasn’t doing that. And then when I got into the pool, I just wanted to stay in there for as long as possible. But that didn’t work out. It was really intense, more so than I remember any of the other ones being and that could just be because it’s more recent, but I really feel like it was more intense.

And I do feel like when it came to trying to get myself together to go to the hospital, I just felt this intense pressure to just try and get through each second that I couldn’t eat really understand what he was saying about that. I do eventually remember going to the living room or something and he was telling me to put clothes on and I was hot. I was like, I can’t put clothes on and I wanted and then I was cold and I wanted the heater on, but as soon as the heater started kicking in, I was like, turn the heater off, it’s way too hot. And I remember getting down on the carpet and just saying, oh, I’m almost… Our carpet is right before, right in front of the doorstep, the front door. So I was like, okay, I’m just going to chill here for a few minutes, and then we can go. And I don’t think I had shoes or anything. I have no clue.

Dimitri:

No.

Mera:

Yeah. I didn’t have shoes on or anything, but I was just like, “I just need to chill here for a few minutes.” And I was facing the door and just riding the wave of a few interactions and then got up and a second later I turned the opposite direction and laid down. I was like, “Okay, this baby’s coming.” I just felt it. And she was pushing through and I was like, “Oh, I can’t hold.” In that very second is when I knew it was going to happen right then. Before that I had no clue, a second later I had no clue. I was like, just to ride this out for a second. But once I turned around the opposite direction, I was like, “She’s coming out right now.” And my water broke right then, everything happened in a second, so.

Rebecca Dekker:

It sounds like it’s the fetal ejection reflex where the baby just comes out without you having to push really hard or anything.

Mera:

Yeah. I think I pushed once.

Dimitri:

Once Yeah.

Rebecca Dekker:

Once. And did the baby come out into your hands Dimitri or?

Dimitri:

Yes.

Mera:

Yeah.

Rebecca Dekker:

And what did you do next?

Dimitri:

So I caught the baby and then basically by that time it was over, so I realized okay, no need to rush now. So we got on the phone with her mom to come pick up the other kids before we went to the hospital. We called the hospital and said, “Hey, we just had a baby in the house. What should we do? Should we just come or what do you want? How do you want to do this?” And they told us, “Yeah, go ahead and come on.” So when her mom picked up the kids, we got into the car and her umbilical cord was still attached.

Rebecca Dekker:

Very delayed cord clamping, basically.

Dimitri:

Yeah. So we wrapped that up and took it with us and got to the hospital. And when I went into the emergency department say, “Hey, just had a baby at home, we’re coming in.” They didn’t understand that. They thought that she was having the baby, like she was in labor. So when they went to the car-

Rebecca Dekker:

And they found a baby.

Dimitri:

And they found apparent a baby, they were like, “Wait, you just had a baby?” I’m like, “Yeah, just had it at home.” “Who delivered it?” I did, it’s me, right here.” “What?” And then we went into the hospital and got all set up. And they did all the things that they do at the hospital. And we got questioned a lot because things don’t usually happen like that. So they were just trying to figure out, did y’all plan on doing this? What happened? There’s a lot of, I guess, a little bit of scrutiny and it’s understandable just because two people just walk in with newborn baby, that’s interesting. Obviously she just had the baby. And then, yeah, I think half of them were pretty amazed that I didn’t have panic attack or something, I don’t know. Or that we were there and we had a baby.

Rebecca Dekker:

Dimitri sounds like you stayed pretty cool through the whole process.

Dimitri:

Yeah, I think so. Like I said, you just got to go with it. There’s nothing you can do at that point. Like she said, when she went down that second time and said, this baby’s coming and I looked, and then I got covered in the fluids and then the head was there. I was like, okay, well this is what’s happening. And that’s all, you can’t really do anything else.

Mera:

Yeah. But you glossed over the whole placenta.

Rebecca Dekker:

Yeah. How did the birth of the placenta go?

Dimitri:

Oh, I forgot about that.

Mera:

Yeah. I didn’t, because that was rough for me. At that point, I felt like myself again, after the baby was out, when he caught her, I was still not fully, I didn’t know how, what position I was in or where the baby was. As a matter of fact, I remember going, where’s the baby? After she came out because I was just not oriented in my body or just shocked or something. But then I went and tried to get the placenta out and I was in the bathroom and that took, how long did that take? It was painful. And it took awhile.

Rebecca Dekker:

So you sat in the bathroom trying to get the placenta out, pushing that out?

Mera:

Yeah.

Rebecca Dekker:

And the whole time were you holding the baby?

Mera:

Yeah, I had her the whole time. Yeah. She was nursing. And so I had the cramps and everything.

Rebecca Dekker:

So you two were skin to skin and she was nursing. And then?

Mera:

Yeah. And once we got that out, he didn’t want to cut it or clamp it or whatever. So we called and asked them about that.

Dimitri:

Oh yeah.

Mera:

Yeah. We called the Costco and asked them about that. And they just said to, what did they say? To cover it and something and bring it in. So, yeah, but I was feeling much better then, I really, in a way wanted to just chill and stay with the baby. But at the same time I knew that, I don’t know. I guess it seemed like a good idea to go there and also with what was potentially going to be an issue with the-

Rebecca Dekker:

With the antibodies?

Mera:

Antibody. I wanted to go and make sure everything was okay, so.

Rebecca Dekker:

Just have you guys checked out and everything?

Mera:

Yeah, but I was still nervous a little bit about how they were going to treat us once we got there, but they were great actually. They did ask us the same story, like 30 times or something like that over the course-

Rebecca Dekker:

Tell us how this happened.

Mera:

Yeah. Over and over again. Yeah. But they were actually pretty good about everything.

Rebecca Dekker:

Yeah. And what did your midwife think or say?

Mera:

Oh, yeah, so our midwife went into, what do you call it? Maternity leave. But it was like forced maternity leave on the same day that our baby was born. So we had texted her or messaged her through the hospital online portal when I first went into labor, like 3:00 or 4:00 that morning or something. And she responded back and we didn’t check it right away. But she responded back saying that she wasn’t going to be there because she had been put on, I don’t remember exactly what the term was, but she was on forced maternity leave. She was around the same, my words are blanking out-

Dimitri:

As far as long as you.

Mera:

Almost as far along as I was. Yeah. So she was not there either, but everyone there was pretty good and I was not your typical patient. I didn’t get anything except vitamin K. That was the only thing that we got, everything outside I denied them getting in. I didn’t let them do the testing that they wanted to do without me being in the room, which they weren’t used to. I was still in there. I was nervous about all that stuff, but they ended up being like, okay. So everything worked out quite well to my surprise.

Rebecca Dekker:

And what was your postpartum experience like after you brought the baby back home and now you have four kids. How did the next few months go for you both?

Mera:

I think, sent the older kids to my grandma’s house for three days or so. And we just adjusted a little bit and he rearranged the whole house, I think. And I think because of the COVID thing, it was a little bit more difficult because once they came back, all the kids are home all day because they’re in virtual school. So I was-

Rebecca Dekker:

You didn’t have any time to yourself with the baby.

Mera:

Yeah. I was pretty exhausted. And he was pretty exhausted, but luckily he had a pretty long-

Dimitri:

Yeah. I had paternity leave, 12 weeks that was paid, but I was also going to school full time as well. So when the baby was born, I was going into the last parts of the semester with finals and everything. So I was trying to balance my schoolwork with making sure that the kids are away and taken care of, that way she can have a little time to herself. So it was a little bit stressful for a little bit.

Mera:

It was really stressful actually. And also because no family really coming around too much. My mom came, I think, twice in the first several months. So it was just, it was isolating and stressful. It was really stressful actually. But after about three months, I think, things started to feel normal. My body also, I think took a long time to heal, but after three months we were fine, but yeah, those first couple of months were really pretty rough.

Rebecca Dekker:

I guess, given how stressful it was. It’s a good thing Dimitri had that 12 weeks of paid paternity leave because it could have been even worse. And we’ve been looking at the research, at Evidence Based Birth® on paternity leave and we plan on publishing some info on that on Instagram. And it’s really unusual to hear that, of a dad getting paid leave, so.

Mera:

Yeah, it would have been so much more difficult if he hadn’t had that for sure. Because even with it, it was still a lot.

Rebecca Dekker:

Do you have any advice for people listening who are planning on entering birth or parenthood soon?

Mera:

I would just say try to get as much information as you can and about possible outcomes and all of the interventions that might happen. And if possible, try to get a good support system around you, even if it’s just a really good provider. But I think the thing that I liked the most about the training were the questions on how to choose a good provider and how to know also how supportive your hospital is or midwife or whatever, of a natural evidence-based birth. Yeah.

Rebecca Dekker:

Oh, sorry.

Mera:

No. And I was just going to say, and just be brave because there’s a lot to be brave about throughout all the parenting, but also pregnancy, sorry, I talk to much.

Rebecca Dekker:

Dimitri.

Dimitri:

I would just say know what your rights are and how to advocate for yourself and don’t panic because it’s going to happen anyway. So just take it second by second and do what you can, don’t argue.

Rebecca Dekker:

The birth is going to happen, so you can, like you said, be panicky or just go with it.

Dimitri:

Yeah. You just got to let it go because this is common, they’re common, and whether it’s at home or you get to the hospital, it’s going to happen. And if you get to a hospital and you’ve done your research and you’ve got a good team and everything, they’re going to take care of you. So just go with it, but know what you can advocate for yourself and don’t let the hospital or doctor bully you into doing something you don’t want to do.

Rebecca Dekker:

And Mera do you have any words of comfort for people who are listening, who may be having their baby after the age of 35? And there’s a lot of fear-mongering and just a lot of fear and anxiety around that. Do you have any words of wisdom for any listeners?

Mera:

Yeah, I will say again, having someone around you to bring you support is really helpful or to validate the evidence for you, that they’re just numbers. You’re an actual person. And your experience is about you and your body and your mind and your whole situation, your support, your environment, everything it’s not your age, is just a number, it really is. So I would just say pay attention to the evidence is the best I can say.

Rebecca Dekker:

And going back to educating yourself, like you discussed. And I think your experience is a good example. There’s a lot of research on midwifery care for people who are 35 and older having babies and how it can really improve outcomes in terms of lowering your chances of having interventions, which are more common as you age and midwifery care is really powerful for that situation as well.

Mera:

Yeah. I highly recommend midwives if you can get one, it’s so much more personal and I think that’s really important in something as special and tender as giving birth. I highly recommend midwives, even what do you call it? Nurse-midwives or home birth midwives, whatever, because a lot of people do want to go into the hospital. I would still recommend trying midwives in the hospital if that’s what you want to do.

Rebecca Dekker:

Thank you, Mera and Dimitri for sharing your story, and congratulations on adding to your family even during a difficult time with COVID. And we are really thankful that everything turned out really well for you and that you had your fourth baby, will always have such an exciting birth story.

Mera:

Thank you. Thanks for all of the information you have compiled and all of the podcasts you’re doing and all the research, it really is so valuable.

Rebecca Dekker:

You’re welcome. All right. Bye you too. Have a good rest of your day.

Mera:

Thanks.

Dimitri:

Bye.

Rebecca Dekker:

Nice meeting you both. Bye. 

This podcast episode was brought to you by the Evidence Based Birth®  childbirth class. This is Rebecca speaking. When I walked into the hospital to have my first baby, I had no idea what I was getting myself into. Since then, I’ve met countless parents who felt that they too were unprepared for the birth process and navigating the healthcare system. The next time I had a baby, I learned that in order to have the most empowering birth possible, I needed to learn the evidence on childbirth practices. We are now offering the Evidence Based Birth® Childbirth class totally online. In your class, you will work with an instructor who will skillfully mentor you and your partner in evidence-based care, comfort measures, and advocacy so that you can both embrace your birth and parenting experiences with courage and confidence. Get empowered with an interactive online childbirth class you and your partner will love. Visit evidencebasedbirth.com/childbirthclass to find your class now.